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KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: David Lee (198.179.0.---)
Date: January 03, 2018 10:06AM

After having built 4 rods for family members I'm finally treating myself to one. The blank: 9'2" Black Hole Striper. The reel: Van Staal VR150 with 20 lb braid.

I've built a KR concept rod before, but never with a double footed RV guide. According to the Fuji catalogue the suggested reduction train for a medium duty outfit is RV > KW-M > KB > KT. Does this mean there are only 2 stripper guides (20H, 12M) before the choke point? I was thinking 20H RV>12M KW> 8 KW make more sense, but then again maybe it's different for surf rods.

On a personal note, I want to say thank you to this great community. I leaned on this site countless times when building my first rods.

ps. If anyone knows where I can find a KW titanium alconite guide in 12M I'd appreciate it!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2018 10:18AM by David Lee.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: Donald R Campbell (---.socal.res.rr.com)
Date: January 03, 2018 11:54AM

David,

I would suggest you ask Jim Ising at Anglers Resource. Jim has always been very responsive to any questions I have submitted to him.

I have Jim's work email address. If you would like to have it, send me an email and I'll send it to you. I don't think Jim would appreciate me posting it on the web page.

Don Campbell
don@sensorfishingrods.com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2018 11:55AM by Donald R Campbell.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: David Lee (198.179.0.---)
Date: January 03, 2018 12:37PM

Thanks, Don. I just sent you an email.

David

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: herb canter (70.40.72.---)
Date: January 03, 2018 01:27PM

David Lee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> After having built 4 rods for family members I'm
> finally treating myself to one. The blank: 9'2"
> Black Hole Striper. The reel: Van Staal VR150
> with 20 lb braid.
>
> I've built a KR concept rod before, but never with
> a double footed RV guide. According to the Fuji
> catalogue the suggested reduction train for a
> medium duty outfit is RV > KW-M > KB > KT. Does
> this mean there are only 2 stripper guides (20H,
> 12M) before the choke point? I was thinking 20H
> RV>12M KW> 8 KW make more sense, but then again
> maybe it's different for surf rods.
>
> On a personal note, I want to say thank you to
> this great community. I leaned on this site
> countless times when building my first rods.
>
> ps. If anyone knows where I can find a KW
> titanium alconite guide in 12M I'd appreciate it!


I have posted looking for a 12 M (Alconite) shorty after i signed up on this forum , very difficult to find one of those as nobody seems to have one for sale . I searched the net far and wide with no luck ,especially with the Alconite ring, i have only seen SIC and Torzite ceramic being offered with the 12 M .

i am interested in knowing when Fuji will release it's new stuff for 2018 , supposedly the RV surf strippers will finally be offered in stainless and it's about time .

People have also been requesting a high frame KW 25 double foot for a long time as well.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: Lance Schreckenbach (---.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
Date: January 03, 2018 03:57PM

Fuji has discontinued the Alconite ring in a Titanium frame. It is too much competition for the SIC ring material with the Ti frame and was considered close enough in price that it would not be noticed. I personally prefer it over SIC because it is slightly lighter. I would not expect Fuji to start making it again. The new CC frame in Alconite is about the closest you are going to get to it now or bite the bullet and get the Ti frame with SIC or Torzite. Mudhole was selling the their last CR concept spinning sets with Ti frames and Alconite rings last month but I believe they sold out.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: herb canter (70.40.72.---)
Date: January 03, 2018 04:46PM

Lance Schreckenbach Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Fuji has discontinued the Alconite ring in a
> Titanium frame. It is too much competition for the
> SIC ring material with the Ti frame and was
> considered close enough in price that it would not
> be noticed. I personally prefer it over SIC
> because it is slightly lighter. I would not expect
> Fuji to start making it again. The new CC frame in
> Alconite is about the closest you are going to get
> to it now or bite the bullet and get the Ti frame
> with SIC or Torzite. Mudhole was selling the their
> last CR concept spinning sets with Ti frames and
> Alconite rings last month but I believe they sold
> out.


Thats probably why it's so hard to find lol. There are 12 M titanium frame alconites out there because it was offered for a short time at some point in the past but not anymore. I also prefer the Alconite to SIC and i believe they're by far Fuji's most popular and best selling ceramic ring material . I was one who jumped at the KW double foot guide set in titanium with Alconite rings . You got a whole set including the KT running guides in size 7 which is the exact size i wanted to use, i had to buy 2 more KT size 7's in titanium because i was two short for my build.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: herb canter (70.40.72.---)
Date: January 03, 2018 04:46PM

Double post , sorry.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2018 04:47PM by herb canter.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: Norman Miller (---.lightspeed.jcsnms.sbcglobal.net)
Date: January 03, 2018 07:15PM

David, I think a 3 guide reduction train would be much better than a 2 guide reduction train. I would try RV20: RV16, and KW10M for the reduction train to your KW 8 runners. Titanium framed guides with Alconite rings have been discontinued by Fuji.
Norm

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: David Lee (---.washdc.fios.verizon.net)
Date: January 03, 2018 09:45PM

Norman Miller Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> David, I think a 3 guide reduction train would be
> much better than a 2 guide reduction train. I
> would try RV20: RV16, and KW10M for the reduction
> train to your KW 8 runners. Titanium framed guides
> with Alconite rings have been discontinued by
> Fuji.
> Norm


Thanks, Norm. This is on par with most of the feedback I received. Would KT runners work in place of KW runners? I'm not concerned with knots or swivels being able to be passed through the guides.

It's also unfortunate that Fuji has decided to discontinue Titanium Alconites. I don't see the value in SiCs to justify the cost over Alconites.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/04/2018 07:07AM by David Lee.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: herb canter (70.40.72.---)
Date: January 04, 2018 12:15AM

Someone said Fuji's thought process on this is that most who spend the extra $$ on titanium frames would not want the Alconite ring material and would prefer SIC which i think is completely wrong . Not only is SIC less popular than Alconite but everything i have seen has people saying it provides zero advantage to anglers in 99% of surfcasting scenarios which i happen to agree with and it's known to be more brittle, thicker in diameter and slightly heaver .

The heat and friction advantages of SIC just don't come into play as much in surfcasting situations unless you're fishing for sharks from the beach of course , Walter Maxwell caught the World record Tiger Shark from the beach and the fight lasted many many hours lol.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/04/2018 12:16AM by herb canter.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: David Lee (---.washdc.fios.verizon.net)
Date: January 04, 2018 12:48AM

herb canter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Someone said Fuji's thought process on this is
> that most who spend the extra $$ on titanium
> frames would not want the Alconite ring material
> and would prefer SIC which i think is completely
> wrong . Not only is SIC less popular than
> Alconite but everything i have seen has people
> saying it provides zero advantage to anglers in
> 99% of surfcasting scenarios which i happen to
> agree with and it's known to be more brittle,
> thicker in diameter and slightly heaver .
>
> The heat and friction advantages of SIC just don't
> come into play as much in surfcasting situations
> unless you're fishing for sharks from the beach of
> course , Walter Maxwell caught the World record
> Tiger Shark from the beach and the fight lasted
> many many hours lol.

Agreed. If anything, a SiC top is probably all you need for most applications. It's a shame really as torzites are out of most people's price range. We are left with a heavier and more brittle guide that's advantages won't be even be felt in most real world scenarios.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: Jim Ising (---.dyn.centurytel.net)
Date: January 04, 2018 10:22AM

Whatever you read about what Fuji is "thinking", we should be able to substantiate as their domestic agent. Titanium ALCONITE® was a low volume item (sales indicate that most want SiC in a titanium frame). I was a fan, used them all the time, but they are gone. All is not lost. The Titanium frame coming out now uses a new "slim" SiC that is very close to the ID of Titanium TORZITE®. Less weight, larger ID's and the heat dissipation of SiC...a beautiful guide. ALCONITE® has been moved into the proprietary Corrosion Control treated frames which, although not as light as Titanium, will provide corrosion resistance that will rival Titanium - a huge extension on the average life of stainless.

We were concerned about the loss of Titanium ALCONITE® as well, but Fuji has given us a choice slightly more (Ti Slim SiC) and slightly less (CC ALCONITE®) than Titanium ALCONITE®. Add to this the the decision to offer the entire K-Series in the CC and BC finish with ALCONITE® and now even more economical FAZLITE™ Rings and it should put Fuji's premier guide designs within reach of even the most budget minded builders.

If you don't have the new catalog detailing all the new stuff, come by the booth at ICRBE or send your mailing address to info@anglersresource.net and we'll mail one out right away.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: Norman Miller (---.lightspeed.jcsnms.sbcglobal.net)
Date: January 04, 2018 10:50AM

Jim, good job. I think we all get a little frustrated when a product we like get discontinued, but we also understand that neither you nor Anglers Resource are involved in Fuji’s decisions, but world wide sales are. Custom rod builders are just a small fraction of their business.

We have gotten a little off track a little on this post. So to reply to David’s last question. David, yes you can use KT runners in lieu of KW. They will work fine and lighten the tip.
Norm



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/04/2018 10:51AM by Norman Miller.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: David Lee (---.washdc.fios.verizon.net)
Date: January 04, 2018 12:49PM

It seems like Fuji knows what they're doing! Now if they only offered the RVs with CC frames. I'm sure they'll pop up in the near future.

Thanks for the feedback, Norm.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: herb canter (70.40.72.---)
Date: January 04, 2018 04:58PM

David Lee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It seems like Fuji knows what they're doing! Now
> if they only offered the RVs with CC frames. I'm
> sure they'll pop up in the near future.
>
> Thanks for the feedback, Norm.


If RV's came in anything other than titanium frames they would explode in popularity even more so than they're now . For me the new CC frames are not a selling point because i have never had any Fuji guide rust in over 30 years of fishing salt water and even with titanium frames i ALWAYS wash down my gear in fresh water afterward .

I suppose they're people that would like to just leave their gear covered with salt water spray after fishing and not worry about it but i'm not one of those people. The new Fazlite and Concept O ceramic ring materials don't do anything for me either but i do think they will sell very well for many other surfcasters looking to save some money .

I want to get my hands on the new Anglers Resource catalog , this has got to be the year Fuji finally offers the RV's in stainless whether it's CC stainless i don't care but people have been waiting and waiting and waiting .

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: Norman Miller (---.lightspeed.jcsnms.sbcglobal.net)
Date: January 04, 2018 05:31PM

Stainless framed RV guides are not in the 2018 catalog. So do not hold your breath.
Norm

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: herb canter (70.40.72.---)
Date: January 04, 2018 05:43PM

Norman Miller Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Stainless framed RV guides are not in the 2018
> catalog. So do not hold your breath.
> Norm



Tell me you're joking ? Norm, c'mon this is no time to play games . Let me guess , Fuji decided to release a high framed KW 25 instead and will continue to only offer the RV series in a titanium frame but wait there's more , a price increase to get the RV 25 H with the Torzite ring over the $100.00 threshold since it's priced at a mere $98.00 a piece right now.

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: Norman Miller (---.lightspeed.jcsnms.sbcglobal.net)
Date: January 04, 2018 07:55PM

Herb, don’t get me wrong, would love to see RV guides in stainless. But based on the the latest Anglers Resource catalog stainless RV guides are not listed, so for the time being they are not available to anyone anywhere. That is not saying they won’t show up sometime in the future, but not in the near future. I agree that the titanium Torzite RVs are out of my price range, but Fuji must be able to sell them to somebody or they would not be on the market. I have noticed that the new St Croix Legend Surf Rods use them, but they are close to $600 ea. I guess there are a lot of fishermen with deeper pockets than me.
Norm

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: herb canter (70.40.72.---)
Date: January 04, 2018 08:43PM

I just went through the new Fuji catalog and not only do they NOT offer the RV in stainless, (People have been requesting this on nearly every saltwater fishing forum since 2014 ) but they also have not bothered with the request of a high frame double foot KW in size 25. They have concentrated on making an RV in sizes 30 and 40 however and they now have new LRV titanium guides to complement the RV's .

Disappointed is an understatement , thoroughly disgusted fits though.


Jim Ising , i know you have no involvement and Fuji does what Fuji wants to do , no need to respond .

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Re: KR Concept Surf with RV KW Reduction
Posted by: Jim Ising (---.dyn.centurytel.net)
Date: January 05, 2018 10:21AM

Thanks for letting me off the hook, Herb!! HAHAHA!!

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