Thanks to all for reading and hopefully offering insight.
With the amount of time required between the five coats of finish (PorKote High Build) for this tiger wrap I doing, what would you veteran / experienced builder consider the minimum number of hours for the epoxy to cure ENOUGH between coats? Let’s use 70*F and less than 50% humidity as the standard. The included ProKote instruction sheet suggests 24 hours for their medium viscosity finish. The high build’s pot life is much shorter than the medium build and I would expect the cure time to be proportionally similar, but I am not certain that is the case. If only one additional coat (two total) were to be applied, I would not be bothering you with the question. However, with stacking-up five coats and being unfamiliar with the properties (shrinkage in particular) of these 1 to 1 epoxies as compared to the 4 to 1 structural epoxies, I would like to avoid any disasters rearing their ugly heads after completion. At the same time, I would like to avoid waiting an additional five days to finish this wrap.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

wow 5 coats that is a lot 2 should be more than sufficient with High build and provide a deep glass appearance if it were me I would let cure for the MFG. recommended time and then lightly scuff the first and apply the second at least you will be assured that their isn't any soft spots that might fish eye on you with the following coats.
Remember that rushing through it is where the problems arise. never make it a hurry up thing!!!

The best day to be alive is always tomorrow !!
Think out side the box when all else fails !!!
Wi.

Most I've ever done is 3 coats, and I've cheated the 24 hour thing by 6 to 8 hours (18 to 16 hour cure) with the temperature 75+.

Some folks apply a second coat as soon as the first is tacky, but I've no experience doing that.

Never done 5, have done 3. I wait until the cure is not longer tacky, but will still finger print.

Humidity won't affect the set or cure time of epoxy. Temperature will, however. Generally you are okay to apply additional epoxy as soon as the previous application allows you to do it. This means as long as the previous epoxy does not grab your brush or your application technique doesn't upset it in some way, you're okay to apply another application.

............

To hurry it up a bit so you can get on to your next coat you can up the heat a bit if you have a simple space/ceramic heater. Let the rod turn until it's cured enough to not sag. Then put the rod & heater in a small room (I have used a utility room or bathroom in the past). Turn the heater on and let the temp rise. It'll likely get over 100 degrees in there. That will get the cure going and shave hours off your time.

In the future, to speed things up, use Flex Coat. Pro Kote takes so long to cure that it makes one wonder if he had screwed up. But it always does, if you wait long enough.

Thanks Mathew, Donald, Eric, Tom, Jay and Michael for responding. I can always rely on you guys. I realize five coats are more than typical but hoping it will create a really deep “lens” between the base-wrap and top-wrap of this tiger wrap. Is it not advisable to stack that many layers of finish regarding either the epoxy itself or visually? Remember, I am unfamiliar with the properties of these 1 to 1 epoxies compared to the 4 to 1s with which I have more experience. I have learned from that other experience it is best to allow the initial cure of the epoxy to be at ambient, warmed only if too cold, but NOT heating to speed things up as it is ultimately detrimental. After cured, an accelerated temperature post cure is beneficial. I have also learned, and should be obvious, a chemical bond (applying the second layer on the first layer while still “green”, is much stronger than a physical bond, (fully cured first layer sanded or scuffed before second is applied).
All of my initial questions have been addressed except the shrinkage factor. Anyone care to comment?

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

These epoxies are no different that the 4 to 1 variety. One part contains fillers to allow for a 1 to 1 mix which the formulators devised in order to make things easier to do in the small batches most builders work with.

...................

Thanks, Tom. Can I assume the shrinkage factor to be extremely low, if not virtually nonexistent as well? While I would normally apply a second coat just past the “No finger print” stage, an additional three coats may become an issue, hence my shrinkage concerns. Many consider epoxies in general to not shrink, but in fact they do, even if extremely little. Although 0.0002 may not cause any noticeable problems for two coats, five coats = 0.001 which may give rise to the ugly heads previously mentioned. Apparently, none of you veterans have (possibly foolishly) attempted this many coats and possibly for good reason. Maybe it will ruin the appearance and effect of the tiger wrap. But that is why I am asking. Most of you on this site should know me well enough by now to know; nothing is made easy for me, and it is admittedly self inflicted.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

Mark, some advice................chill out! Building rods should be fun in addition to the other elements of the experience. The questions you ask sometimes seem to be a large amount of worry.

phil, what you say seems to be exagerated with a lot of rod builders...too much analizing. lol.

Phil and Ben,
Understood and accepted but only 75% agreed. At the risk of sounding rude or unappreciative, I have as much fun planning, calculating and “worrying” as applying the last coat of finish and admiring how nice the fruits of my labor turned out. Depending on how it is viewed or ones perspective, I am very analytical and picky, anal-retentive if you will, to a fault or not. There is the RIGHT way, the WRONG way, and then there is MY way. But I truly enjoy every aspect of every project I fabricate, rod building included, worrying incorporated.
For what it is worth, I think I’ll leave it at three coats.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

Mark, did not mean it as being rude. It just seems to mean that you seek information on subjects that are infinitesimal to the process of custom rod building. It is not a science!

It should be a pleasurable rewarding experience.

I really do appreciate your interest in broadening your knowledge, but think you sometimes go beyond the necessary, example the question regarding shrinkage.,



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/06/2017 11:54PM by Phil Erickson.

Some have been doing it for a long time and some not and YES they have questions that some times seem like extreme but that is all part of the learning curve with rod building.
Stop and think how you asked several questions when you started this endeavor were they beyond the necessary ??
Don't know who said it but it is oh so true.
The man that asks questions continues to learn and grow
Lets all learn and grow together

The best day to be alive is always tomorrow !!
Think out side the box when all else fails !!!
Wi.

With HB I normally wait say 8 hours between coats but if I need to sand between I wait more (at least 12 hours but 24 hours better).
It's work for me (depend on temp).

________________________________________
@+
Eric
[www.emfishing.fr]

hi mark..i typed an lol after my remark mostly because i,m laughing at myself that i see in you.. i,ve been tinkering with rods for over 50 years and experienced a good bit of the quirks of rod building and when i see others having to experience these things it brings up a chuckle and reminds me of my little conflicts with the same question although i must admit your questions are a little deeper than mine were...you make my head hurt sometimes. lol

Thanks, Eric. Information I can use.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

Mark - If you want an epoxy that set ups quicker than try Treadmaster. A drawback is that it has a shorter pot life, not a problem for me. Another option is to try the Billy Vivona mix, which is a mix of Treadmaster and ProKote at a ratio of 1:1:1:1 (TM A:TMB:PKA:PkB). This mix gives properties intermediate between TM and PK. Billy has experimented with all the different finishes and settled on this mix as his standard.

Norm

Thank you Norman, your research, insight and wisdom is always appreciated and utilized. I never considered mixing different brands of rod finish epoxy as it is a big no-no with the structural epoxies which with I am more familiar.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.