I
nternet gathering place for custom rod builders
  • Custom Rod Builders - This message board is provided for your use by the sponsors listed on the left side of the page. Feel free to post any question, answers or topics related in any way to custom building. When purchasing products please remember those who sponsor this board.

  • Manufacturers and Vendors - Only board sponsors are permitted and encouraged to promote and advertise products on the board. You may become a sponsor for a nominal fee. It is the sponsor fees that pay for this message board.

  • Rules - Rod building is a decent and rewarding craft. Those who participate in it are assumed to be civilized individuals who are kind and considerate in their dealings with others. Please respond to others in the same fashion in which you would like to be responded to. Registration IS NOW required in order to post. You must include your actual First and Last name and a correct email address when registering or posting. Posts which are inflammatory, insulting, or that fail to include a proper name and email address will be removed and the persons responsible will be barred from further participation.

    Registration is now required in order to post. You must include your actual First and Last name and a correct email address when registering or posting.
SPONSORS

2018 Expo
Common Cents Info
CCS Database
Int. Custom Rod Symbol
All American Guides
American Tackle
Angler’s Roost
Anglers Rsrc - Fuji
Anglers Workshop
BatsonRainshadowALPS
Bingham Enterprises
Canada Rodbuildersupply
CRB
Cork4Us
CTS Rod Blanks
CTS MAVEN
Custom Fly Grips LLC
Custom Labeling System
DBlue Fishing
Decal Connection
DONART
Flex Coat Co.
Get Bit Outdoors
Hitena USA
HYDRA
Janns Netcraft
Mickels Custom Rods
Mudhole Custom Tackle
MHX Rod Blanks
Pacific Bay
ProProducts
Reelseatblanks.com
Renzetti Inc.
Rocky Mountain Rod Shop
Rod Components USA
Rodgeeks
RodMaker Magazine
RodMaker Magazine Blog
Schneiders Rod Shop
SeaGuide Corp.
St Croix Rods
Tackleworks
The Rod Room
Trondak U-40
Utmost Enterprises
VisualWRAP/VisualWEAVE
ZipCast

Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: Steve Van Winkle (---.dynamic.mt-opticom.com)
Date: March 16, 2017 12:42AM

I've built Rods for years, but I've had an epoxy issue the last several rods I've never seen before nor can I figure out why it's happening.

The best way to describe it is "soft spots." After the epoxy cures, I've come back and noticed tiny dimples in the finish. When I press on them, they become cloudy, almost as if there is un-cured epoxy just below the surface. When I cut them out with a blade, they felt "crystallized." (I'd include a pic but don't know how to post one). Are these "fish eyes?"

After I first noticed it and it happened more than once, I removed and cleaned surfaces, bought new flex coat, used new syringes, new stirring sticks, and wiped off all tools, thinking there might be silicone on something. I can't think of anything I didn't trade out from previous rods.

Looking at the one I finished after replacing/cleaning everything, it's better, but there is still one of these soft spots. One is better than the numerous ones I had before, but it's driving me nuts.

The only possible source of silicone remaining is blue tape, but I have no idea if there's silicone in it and have never had problems using it in the past.

Has anyone seen these things before? If so, what causes them? Any help at all would be greatly appreciated.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/16/2017 01:09AM by Steve Van Winkle.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: Chris Herrera (---.sub-70-199-147.myvzw.com)
Date: March 16, 2017 04:38AM

Steve,

A couple of things that would cause different problems:

My first thought: Check for crystals in your resin. This includes the bottle or syringe. If they are just starting to form, you may not see them easily.

Have you switched to a new thread?

Are you using razor blades that may have oil on them? Not all solvents are created equal, when it comes to oil or grease.

Are you wrapping, or finishing, in an area that could get over spray from an air freshener, perfume/cologne, cooking spray, or spray lubricant?

Are you using hand lotion, because of the cold, dry air?

Some things to consider.

Take care,

Chris



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/16/2017 05:25AM by Chris Herrera.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: Jay Dubay (---.try.wideopenwest.com)
Date: March 16, 2017 05:50AM

Well if you have been Building Rods for years without issue, Then you need to Look at what has {Recently changed} Are you using CP ?? And if so are you letting it dry overnight, or longer? I wait 24 hrs Before applying ANY epoxy. {Quote} {When I press on them, they become {cloudy} almost as if there is uncured epoxy just below the surface} That tells me Your Color Preserver has Not Dried and there is moisture trapped under your epoxy. I suggest when a problem occurs that you review all your building procedures in the Library to refresh your memory. Most of the time it's something very little that can cause these issues, That we Happen to overlook . I don't believe the green tape is your problem as many of us use the sticky side like a tack cloth to remove dust before applying epoxy with no problems. Nor do I believe you are having Fisheyes as those are pretty easy to determine, Your finish will pull away from the spot and leave a hole, If you add more epoxy it will do the same thing. If you're using CP let it dry!!. Cheers and good luck. Jaa

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: Tom Kirkman (Moderator)
Date: March 16, 2017 08:03AM

It's not silicone. As Chris mentioned above, it's most like it's very small crystalized resin bits. Unable to mix with the hardener, they never harden on the rod, leaving small uncured bits of rubbery resin in your finish.

Set the resin bottle in a pan of very hot water for a bit, or remove the cap and hit it in the micro wave for a 6 to 10 second burst. Let cool a minute and repeat. Most likely that'll take care of your issue.

...................

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: Steve Van Winkle (---.dynamic.mt-opticom.com)
Date: March 16, 2017 11:02AM

Thanks for the help, everyone.

I don't use CP, so that's not the issue, but I did have crystals, and the syringes were old and I noticed crystallization in them. This is why I decided to trade everything out; the finish parts were down to the bottom of the bottles, so it was time anyway.

My confusion was the one spot I had after I applied a coat using all new finish and syringes; however, this may have been a spot I missed on the previous inspection as well. I'll know for sure when I do the next rod, but the crystal theory was one I had and you guys seem to confirm it for me.

And, on Chris' list are a number of things I need to shore up and appreciate that counsel as well.

Thanks very much.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: roger wilson (---.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
Date: March 16, 2017 01:45PM

Steve,
One thing that I do about every 6 months, is to put the containers of rod finish in the microwave for 10 seconds or so, to be sure that each of the finish containers have dead clear liquid in them.

If any crystals have formed, short bursts of the microwave do an excellent job in removing the crystals.

Also, about once a month, I am very diligent about cleaning up the syringes. I just use DNA and a rod to be sure that every spec of any material has been cleaned out of and wiped off of every surface - both on the inside and the outside of each of the syringes.

Under normal use, I don't clean the syringes. I just keep them in the same container in a vertical repose and any excess material drips off of the syringe into the excess container.

I also use new plastic cups to mix each batch of finish. I use a craft mixing stick that has been wiped off from its previous use.

Another thing to be sure - is to not use any solvent or similar to clean a blank that may leave some residue behind.

Also, wash your hands, wash your hands, wash your hand.

Take care

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: Capt. Michael Harmon (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: March 16, 2017 02:35PM

All good possibilities list above. How do you mix the resin and how long do you mix the resin? I havent experienced the problem you are having but like someone said above what are you doing differently now? Good luck.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: Steve Van Winkle (---.dynamic.mt-opticom.com)
Date: March 16, 2017 02:35PM

Roger...

Again, you point out some things I am not currently doing that will be a big help in the future, like cleaning syringes and storing upright.

Very helpful.

Thanks again,

Steve

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: Capt. Michael Harmon (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: March 16, 2017 02:35PM

All good possibilities list above. How do you mix the resin and how long do you mix the resin? I havent experienced the problem you are having but like someone said above what are you doing different now? Good luck.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: Lynn Behler (---.97.252.156.res-cmts.leh.ptd.net)
Date: March 16, 2017 05:36PM

Good call, Chris.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: Randy Weakley (---.client.mchsi.com)
Date: March 17, 2017 09:53AM

Tom Kirkman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's not silicone. As Chris mentioned above, it's
> most like it's very small crystalized resin bits.
> Unable to mix with the hardener, they never harden
> on the rod, leaving small uncured bits of rubbery
> resin in your finish.
>
> Set the resin bottle in a pan of very hot water
> for a bit, or remove the cap and hit it in the
> micro wave for a 6 to 10 second burst. Let cool a
> minute and repeat. Most likely that'll take care
> of your issue.
>
> ...................
Plus this helps the mixing and releasing bubbles due to the lower viscosity. I've started setting my stuff in hot (from the tap) water while I get my stuff set up and cleaned for the application process.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: roger wilson (---.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
Date: March 17, 2017 10:44AM

Randy,
Read and understood.

However, the down side of putting the finish in hot water, is that the warmer temperatures can remarkably shorten the pot life of the finish.

I would rather have a bit cooler finish - even with a few bubbles upon first application in favor of a longer pot life.

Heat can always be added to the finish after applying as long as there is sufficient finish on the rod in the first place.

But, as has been said many many times before.

"Figure out a technique for doing a job that works well for you and then perfect it."

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Epoxy Mystery
Posted by: John Wright (---.om.om.cox.net)
Date: March 21, 2017 07:57PM

roger wilson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Steve,
> One thing that I do about every 6 months, is to
> put the containers of rod finish in the microwave
> for 10 seconds or so, to be sure that each of the
> finish containers have dead clear liquid in them.
>
>
> If any crystals have formed, short bursts of the
> microwave do an excellent job in removing the
> crystals.
>
> Also, about once a month, I am very diligent about
> cleaning up the syringes. I just use DNA and a
> rod to be sure that every spec of any material has
> been cleaned out of and wiped off of every surface
> - both on the inside and the outside of each of
> the syringes.
>
> Under normal use, I don't clean the syringes. I
> just keep them in the same container in a vertical
> repose and any excess material drips off of the
> syringe into the excess container.
>
> I also use new plastic cups to mix each batch of
> finish. I use a craft mixing stick that has been
> wiped off from its previous use.
>
> Another thing to be sure - is to not use any
> solvent or similar to clean a blank that may leave
> some residue behind.
>
> Also, wash your hands, wash your hands, wash your
> hand.
>
> Take care


Roger, what is DNA? Denatured Alcohol? or the stuff life is made of :-)

Options: ReplyQuote


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
Webmaster