Wanted to see what the typical markup is from some of the builders here. I've got a few people wanting rods built and want to give them a fair quote. Just a basic build with no decorative wraps. Thanks all.

100-400%

Scott,
Rod building a really nice rod takes skill.
What does a skilled person in the trades - get per hour? $20,$30,$40,$50 per hour.

Lets look at the low end of the scale. $20 per hour How long do you spend in actual working time on a rod? Do not count drying times.

I would think that for a preassembled grip and reel seat and simple wraps with a single trim inlay that the build time would be about 2 hours. So, at $20 per hour - $40 for labor and however much you want to mark up materials.

But, if charging $50 per hour, then it would be $100 for labor and mark up on materials.

If, you are making a complicated rod with special wraps and inlays on the handle - you might have 40 hours building a rod. Thus, multiply the time spent by the labor rate that you believe you should charge.

At the local rod shop which has a number of in house builders, they generally figure on hour on a build. i.e. 15 minutes for grip and reel seat assembly, 10 minutes for placing guides, 30 minutes to wrap the rod and 5-10 minutes to apply finish.

This is for casting and spinning rods with up to 10 guides on a rod.

Of course most of these folks have over 1000 rods under their belt - so to speak.

Good luck

If you look at tours of a rod factory like lamiglas, St. Croix or Loomis - these numbers appear to be similar. Remember, in the factories, all of the grips and reel seats are presized for the build in question.

Downer Alert: Not sure if you are aware of it, but if you buy components, assemble a rod and sell it, you are considered a manufacturer and are required by Federal Law to collect the excise tax (FET) on sport fishing equipment and send it to the government. To do that you'll need an EIN and you will file a quarterly form 720.

_________________________________________
"Angling is extremely time consuming.
That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

I'll not dispute Roger's numbers; they are what they are.

Here is another perspective on pricing that begins with the formula Value = Quality / Price. Price is easy in that it is easy to measure in $s. Quality is difficult as it is at least in part subjective and begs questions about differentiation. What is it about the rods you contemplate that makes them different or better or more desirable to a prospective purchaser than a similar, off the rack, factory rod? If the answer is there is minimal differentiation then it will be difficult to sell many rods at a price substantially greater than the price of a factory rod regardless of your component costs, labor, etc. On the other hand, if you can demonstrate multiple and superior points of differentiation, even for a "basic build" as you describe it, then you have the opportunity to realize a higher sale price, again without regard to your costs and labor. Said another way around, a cost plus pricing approach risks over pricing on one end of the Value perception formula and under pricing on the other. So, the question is what can you do for a "basic build" to differentiate your work product so as to command a premium price? ("Fair" is what a seller and a buyer agree it is; nothing more and nothing less.) I'll step down from the soap box now.

I will throw in my $0.02 here:

First off: there is a nice 3 part series of articles in RodMaker Magazine from 2005 (Volume 8; Issues 3, 4, & 5) that go over pricing custom rods. If you don't have those issues, I believe Tom is having a sale on buying the back issues of RodMaker right now of $5 / magazine if you get 3 or more. Better yet... if you go to the ICRBE in about a month, you can buy them there for $3 a piece. There is a lot of good info you will glean from reading those articles.

Secondly: While technically you should incorporate a business and get an EIN so you can charge and send in the FET, if you are still new to rod building and are still getting settled in to the craft and figuring everything out, you can sell some products and make a few bucks without worrying about running afoul of the law and having the IRS knock on your door! I'm not advocating breaking the law.... but there is a de minimis allowance in everything, and as long as your gain (and the tax equivalent) isn't anything to write home about... you will be ok. If you end up selling a lot of rods and start to realize real income from your work, then you can file as a business and start collecting all appropriate taxes.

Next: My son is 14. He's built 6 rods so far, and has sold 2 for a profit. He has received indications of interest for about 4 or 5 more. Right now (he is in the "just starting out" phase and in the "I'm still in school and don't need to earn a huge premium on my work while I want to get my name out there as a possible rod builder" phase) when he quotes a price, it is based on all costs to get the components and necessary supplies for the build, to include shipping costs, plus a $30 to $50 profit. That seems reasonable to me. He makes a little bit of money to save or to buy more "tools" but isn't charging a real premium for his work (which, right now is probably worth $30 profit but it improves every build!). As he gets better at his craft and can make his "fit and finish" work look impeccable as well as complete more sophisticated and complex looking design work, then we can charge a greater premium over the cost. And sometime before then, we will file as a DBA and be a real, legitimate business.

Lastly: It is my understanding that most "professional rod builders" will have a different building fee for different types of rods and whether or not that type of rod is in the "niche" building specialty.

Hope that is some good information for you!

Best,
Gib

Father to William (15 yrs), who I hope has found his passion in custom rod building!

Just my opinion - A quality custom rod is much more than just an assembly consisting of pre-formed grips and guides wrapped according to a chart.

I used to invite customers down to my shop where they could flex various blanks, look at grip materials & length options, and plan guide sizes and layouts according to reel, line size, and casting ability if required. Many of my customers opted for much smaller guides on rods used strictly for vertical jigging or Lindy rigging. Many times they would bring me a rod or two that they currently used and they would explain what they liked or did not like about its function, or grip size. Sometimes we would put their rod on my test jig and compare it to blanks in stock to try and fine tune a power or action that they wanted.

It can be quite a process. On a lighter note - I learned early on to hide about half of my thread colors when the guys were bringing their wives along to pick colors.

_________________________________________
"Angling is extremely time consuming.
That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

you can make a really high quality rod from preformed blanks preformed reel seats, preformed guides and preformed grips.

Thank you all for the info.
Couldn't I just set this up as a Sole Proprietorship? I'm not doing this to try and make living at it. I just enjoy doing it. Give me all the downer alerts you like I won't be discouraged. This gentleman sought me out after showing some builds I did. So, evidently he saw something he liked in my work. When I asked him what his budget was he said it really didn't matter. Now, I know that it really does matter, but It seems he had confidence in my work. Thanks again for the comments.

Hello Scott.

If you really feel that way just do it for costs, what do you care your just doing it because you like to right?

Me? I build for costs for some special friends, but I usually want a little something from most just so that they wont think they are owed or that "you did it before" "why not again" @#$%&.

If I don't like you at all I wont build you a rod at all, but just a minor too medium pest will receive a rod at high$ like $75.00 too $100.00hr.

Tight Wraps & Tighter Lines.

Bob,

New Bern, NC.

Scott, Did you ever see how long the line is in a Starbucks coffee shop. If someone is willing to spend that kind of money for a cup of coffee I think you should charge accordingly.

Dennis J. Danku
(Sayreville,NJ)

you can't get your car fixed because the mechanic just likes to do it don't be foolish and let the idea of doing a good deed and having incurring a tax burden to do so.
The cost of the parts 50-100 % mark up remember the shipping costs is part of your mark up and labor minimum of 25.00 an hour very generous!! it is your time,talent and tools no matter what they are you still had to make them or buy them.
Use blanks that come with a warranty if possible if there would be a problem your covered and can get a new blank for the customer. if you don't use a warrantied blank be sure you tell them you don't warranty the blank just your work if it breaks then it is their problem and not yours.
there a lot of pit falls to navigate doing custom work for others.
what I stated above is fare charges for a rod when your starting out

The best day to be alive is always tomorrow !!
Think out side the box when all else fails !!!
Wi.

Roger Wilson mentioned times that he felt some house builders spent on rods but you should also figure in the time it took to determine all the correct components, ordering, unpacking, time spent with the customer on determining the specs, i.e., all the non-building time. It is time you will spend so one hour to "build" a rod in my opinion is short changing your effort. Example, I have a potential build for a fly blank to center pin rod, I bet I spent close to an hour just on the internet researching the exact type of blank the customer wanted.

Just make sure you have fun regardless of how much you make, if you start worrying about profit you will turn your hobby into a job, do you need another set of headaches? LOL

Ray Zarychta
Glastonbury, CT

roger wilson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> At the local rod shop which has a number of in
> house builders, they generally figure on hour on a
> build. i.e. 15 minutes for grip and reel seat
> assembly

I must be slow. I spent 20 minutes just hand reaming a custom carbon skinned foam core grip split grip set last night. Then another 20 or so to mix up some Rod Bond and get them on and cleaned up. However, this was on a personal rod so I enjoyed it.

If you're building for friends, how about having them come over and you show them how to build their own? I have done that a couple of times and it went just okay with one guy, but another one was a young man that was suffering through the breakup of his parent's marriage. We had a great time together. He brought some of his music and favorite movies on some visits. He took that rod on several fishing trips and showed me many pictures of smallmouth bass that he took with it.

Some of the most uncomfortable "customer" dealings I had were with friends that abused rods (stepped on) that I built for them and they expected free replacement when they broke. Awkward!

Ask yourself this - do I really want to take a relaxing hobby and turn it in to a job? If you do, that's fine. Do your research and set your prices and stick with it. I came up with a formula that had a markup on parts, cost per inch for any cork lathe work, cost per inch for carbon skinned grips, cost per single or double foot guide wrap, etc. I also had a fixed charge that included supplies like adhesives, finish epoxy, decals, wrapping thread, etc. Every component, tool and fixture in your shop that you purchased for rod building is an expense. If you don't pass that on to the customer you will be shorting yourself.

_________________________________________
"Angling is extremely time consuming.
That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

Scott,

When I first started my business building custom rods, (I guess I am what is called a "Hobby Builder"), I asked a component distributor how to price a rod. His reply was "everyone uses a different method to determine their sale price; but if you aren't making a $100 per rod you won't be in business a year from now". I take a lot of pride in what I build and will not rush it, static load every rod and use the best components the client can afford. As a result, I stopped trying to price my rods based on the hours I spent building it.

Being retired as a CEO of a civil engineering firm I was used to making the 6 figure income and never expected to duplicate that income with rod building. I just totally enjoy rod building and the rewards are not about the money I have earned. I am convinced I do not charge enough for my rods; but as mentioned prevoiusly the competition is "store bought" rods. If I have a buyer who starts comparing my prices with a store bought rod, I wish him the best and pass on the build. I have many clients who have purchased 5 to 10 rods from me and they are my best marketing tool. The rewards comes from a previous client telling a prospective client "Don builds one @#$%& of a rod"!

Don Campbell
don@sensorfishingrods.com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/26/2017 12:07PM by Donald R Campbell.

Chuck,
When I posted the times for rod construction, I am basing these times on pre fitted grips and reel seats. i.e. the grip comes out of the container, glue is applied to the blank and the grip is put in place.

If you assemble a grip from rings and do all of the piece work associated with that part of the build - you could end up with several hours in just building the grip.

So, time is very much dependent on the amount of prebuilt items in the particular build of a rod.

Scott, Competitive pricing keeps the craft alive. Its your workmanship that brings you business.

Dennis J. Danku
(Sayreville,NJ)