So my very first build looks fantastic...size D thread, color preserver , 2 coats of ProKote..flawless (I was shoked)

2nd rod....size D thread, NO color preserver , 2 coats of epoxy and didn't come out nearly as nice..finish not as smooth, thread texture on the foot visible....I assume all this because no color preserver or do I need a different technique with or without CP?

I didn't use the color preserver because I got nervous hearing about how it isn't as strong as with out it.....so @#$%&!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/04/2017 09:49PM by Jon Salter.

Color preserver has no practical ill effect on wrap strength.

..............

Jon,
Out of curiosity, what sort of rods have you built that made you decide to use D size thread? Unless you have a real need and a particular reason to use D sized thread, the use of A sized thread gives a smoother finish, simply because the thread size is smaller with A than with D and thus has a smoother finish - before adding any epoxy finish to the rod.

Rod builders can get equally excellent builds when using CP as well as not using CP. But, certainly the rods have a different look with the use of CP compared to non NCP thread not using CP.

Good luck

There is nothing wrong with using D thread. For a beginner it is much easier to use and usually gives very good results that look great. When you use color preserver the epoxy finish does not penetrate the threads, it just sits on top. So the first coat gives you a nice smooth level finish and the second coat will cover any flaws. However, if you do not use CP then the epoxy penetrates the threads so the first coat may look thin and uneven showing the individual threads, and if you use too thin of a second coat the imperfection may remain, albeit at a lower level. The way you fix this is to give it another coat. For a beginner it is very difficult to have a feel for how much epoxy to use. I am sure you have read that to much finish is not good and can cause cosmetic problems that are difficult to correct. Too little finish can also cause cosmetic problems, but is easy to correct by adding another coat. This can also happen with A thread if the coats are to thin. The other thing that could have cause your problem is that you used an embroidery thread, like Madeira. These threads are coated with a silicone lubricant, and if CP is not used you can get a phenomenon known a fish eyes. If this is the case then use a thread made for rod wrapping, or make sure you use CP when using this type of thread. Hope this helps, and I hope it is the first scenario and not the second.
Norm

So I used D because the rod was a cheap kit I had gotten for my son and to practice, also I have 2 "customer" builds coming up so I was saving the A thread for those.
I think I found the issue. Just as it was stated with the CP my first coat was clean and the second even cleaner. On the second rod I feel I put too much epoxy in the first coat hence some uneven spots...second only made it worse.
I just built a the same kit for my other son...NO CP again but this time I made sure my first coat was thin....looks like that will solve the issue as even though it's rough all the wraps are even...I am anticipating the second coat will finish the wraps nice this time around!



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/04/2017 11:39PM by Jon Salter.

Sounds nice compared to my second build. I thought I mixed the two epoxys but it turns out I put both syringes in the resign container! Sat and fiddled with it making it look nice and what not and left it to dry overnight came back the next day and still was was wet. Realizing my mistake I brushed it all off and put the hardener on hoping it would do the trick but it only dried spotty. So took some denatured alcohol wiped it all away and went over it again but still have lumps and such! Boy what a pain but what a nice little learning experience at the same time:) always pay attention!

It does no good to apply one part of the epoxy on top of the other, they must be mixed together thoroughly before application! Once you started trying to wipe away the problem the job was finished, almost impossible to get a nice wrap finish, best to start all over. As you stated, not paying attention created a good lesson.

Jon

I assume you are using the Prokote medium build flavor epoxy. If so, it is not uncommon for wraps not treated with CP to require a 3rd coat assuming the first two applications were nice and thin. I finished a 3 wt fly rod build yesterday using ProKote medium. The #2/0 guides might have covered with one coat, but they and the rest got two. The stripper and last snake guide got a 3rd application. I was using size A NCP. The trick is to keep each application as even and thin as you can possibly manage, and do not panic after the 1st or 2nd applications. There is no shame if a wrap needs a 3rd application. Trying to apply the epoxy in gobs to avoid a 2nd or 3rd application rarely if ever works out well.

I always count on using two coats, whether with or without CP. I use lite Flex Coat and apply the first coat in a thin coat. Then I repair any defects, note where it is too thin, and do the second coat, also thin. And that usually does it just fine. I do it this way to get good coverage without having the "football" shaped wraps

So third rod is coming along MUCH better than the second!
Thanks for the help.

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I agree with Michael I use a different finish, and sometimes thin it, but do the same. I still use size E thread on occasion. There's no shame in seeing individual threads in a wrap.