Hello all, this is more of a fishing question, but since I'm building the rod that it is going on, I figured I'd post here rather than registering on a new forum.

I'm going to build a 20-40 lbs rod for yellowtail. It will be my first conventional rod. I have a bass baitcaster, but this will be my first saltwater conv. Anyways I will be either bottom fishing bait, fly lining and possibly jigging. The blank will likely be the MHX Saltwater graphite of said power/line rating.

I was thinking around 300 yds of 30 lbs mono sized reel, but will likely be using braid, which means almost 600 yds to fill up. So I'm looking for suggestions on size. Should I go smaller since I will likely use braid, or should I give myself the option on putting a healthy amount of mono?

Secondly, the ones I can afford, I.e. Squall or Warfare or Defiance all have poor reviews. So I was thinking about going used. But it seems many of the older reels are way lighter on the drag than newer reels. Is 10 lbs enough?

An finally, many of the ones I have seen are not level wind. I imagine I could get the hang of it on a retrieve, but I don't know how well I'd do while fighting a fish trying to thumb guide the line back and forth. Is this a quick skill to learn, or should I stick to getting a level wind?

Thanks, and I hope you don't mind this type of post!

Check out the Daiwa Saltiist reels.

Penn Senators have caught an awful lot of fish and they are rugged, reliable, and easy to maintain. Thousands of head-boat businesses can't be too wrong.

Avet all day!!

Thanks...have looked at Senators, but those don't have a level wind. Like I said I think I could figure it out quite easy on a retrieve, but trying to fight a big fish seems like it would be hard to focus on thumbing the line.

What size Senator is recommended for this application?

Check out the Senator 112 (3/0 size) and the Jigmaster. Both have the same size spool. Some people do use chrome plated brass spools while others use aluminum. For a while, plastic spools were made.

Don Becker

There is a learning curve between fresh and salt water fishing - both ways. Tens of millions of fresh water fishermen have learned to get along without a level-wind attachment, and many millions of salt water fishermen have learned to cast with only one hand.

I have caught many fish over 40+lbs on my Jigmasters and Squidders, and much larger on my Senators, with absolutely no problem.

Ron Weber

So there is a Senator with 2.0:1 gears and 20 lbs of drag and a Special Senator with 4.1:1 gears and 11 lbs of drag...which is the go to model? I don't know much about gear ratios. I know low gives more cranking power and high gives faster line retrieve, but no real world knowledge of how it feels.

Thanks for the Avet and Saltist suggestion, but that's out of my $$$ range.

Randy,

There is a Penn 309M entry level reel that meets most of your stated requirements.
It's under general purpose reels.
Low cost, level wind, capacity 300 yards of 30 lb mono. The gear ration is 2.8:1

It may work for you until you get a good feel for your needs in the types of fishing you describe.

I have never used one. Perhaps others have and will give an opinion.

Don Becker

Shimano tekota 600 level wind. should do what you want it to. As far as learning to do without the level wind, no big deal, just have to pay attention to the line pile. A narrow spool reel like a shimano tyrnos 12 would also fit your needs and is easier to thumb guide the line as it has a narrower spool. I deep drop of the coast of VA, avg depth 300-600 ft, and I love my trynos 12 for that application.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/18/2015 09:05AM by Capt. Craig Freeman.

Thanks for the recommendations guys! It seems the Jigmaster and the Senator are within my price range and can be upgraded to better parts later on if they get worn out.

The Tekota looks like a solid reel, but again is a bit out of my price range.

I'm decently coordinated, so I suppose I can manage the learning curve that comes with a non level wind system.

This forum is great and I really appreciate the time everyone puts in to help us newbs. Onward to the build!

...now I just gotta pick up a back issue of Rodbuilder to get some guidance on the acid wrap I hope to use. I think I'm gonna do a U of H color theme for the cross and guide wraps. Go Coogs!

All depends on where you are fishing. If I was dropping serious coin on a long range trip out of south cal. I'd want three outfits.

I'd want a 15-20# class for fly lining. This is more light line finesse stuff for picky fish. If you already had a powerful freshwater outfit....mag bass/steelhead/salmon (12-25#)....8+ foot long.....with a reel that held 250+ yards of 15-20# test....that would do. You need to be able to cast light live baits a long ways. You want a quality drag. If I didn't have anything I'd look at an avet sx, penn 525 mag, slosh 20, or stradic 8000. Should be a capable albacore outfit too.

The total opposite is yo-yo'ing in deeper waters for big fish. Here I'd go with a 7 foot glass/composite rod with 40-50# class reel. Penn's baja special is a nice choice but there are many others. Yellowtail are major leauge fighters. They hang around tough bottom cover and sea lions love to steal them. You need real muscle here and 80# braid isn't out of the question. If you are fishing party boats I'd go with a 100 yards of mono on top.....because tangles will happen and with braid they are impossible to deal with. Could be you will never venture down to Baja and catch such fish though????

Then you would want something in the 30# class range for surface iron. Here you are looking at a 9 foot jig stick, again glass/composite. The reel needs to be a good caster but have some serious balls too. Avet makes jx sense here. I would be very comfortable buying a used one (I think they are one of the best deals in reels around but you need to not exceed drag ratings or you will eat bearings). Daiwa slosh would do on the cheaper end. I'd want a higher retrive ratio so nix the penn senators.

Forget the level wind. If I was fishing the abu 6500 I'd remove mine. Not saying you couldn't find a capable level wind. Just saying you are better off getting over needing one. Counting on a feature that isn't serious salt water fish capable is bound to end poorly.

Russ in Hollywood, FL.

Thanks for the very comprehensive answer Russell. I have a Shimano Baitrunner 6000 OC that looks like it may fit the bill for the fly lining. I could set that out while fishing low with the conventional. Will take a look at the suggestions.

The Special Senator has a 4.1:1 ratio. If you say go higher, what are you recommending?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/19/2015 01:09AM by Randy Weakley.

Randy: If I were fishing over heavy structure such as rocks, reef, or wrecks I would stay with a low gear ratio reel.

Randy, my favorite go to outfits are typically used with a Jigmaster reel. I have 501s and 99 sized in use more than others. You can buy a used 500 or 501 on the big @#$%& site for a reasonable price. There are also a great many flea markets where they can be found as well. The money you save can be used to upgrade the reel. I suggest an Accurate kit in the 99 size. The 99 size reel,in conjunction with spectra line,will give you plenty of capacity shoul you find yourself locked up with a bigger tuna or yellowtail. It happens and you will appreciate the extra capacity. The full on 500 size Jigmaster is a dinosaur. Other internal upgrades can be found on Alan Tani's website. If you are only fishing a 25# topshot,you really don't need alot more drag than what is stock.

I never started with levelwind reels as a kid. I saw too much go wrong with them. I never had an issue with guiding line on my reels. And I have short thumbs. As mentioned above,keep your gear ratio low. Don't worry about 5 or even 6 to 1 unless fishing the iron. Even then,picking a better swimming jig is my preference over a ridiculously high geared reel.

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. I ended up finding a pristine rebuilt Senator (made in USA) spooled with 30lb mono on the web @#$%&. Went ahead and picked it up. Will definitely bookmark this thread as I will probably do another conventional build at some point. May do a Jigmaster next time. I think I'm done with spinners. I have like 10 of them from UL trout rods to an 8' 6" heavy saltwater with a 6000 size Penn spinner. Time to start working the baitcast/conventional rigs!

The reel I got is red so will match the color theme for my rod as well. Now gotta find a blank. May be a whole new thread ha ha! I'll do my research first tho so don't worry!

Calstar or Seeker 270-8H. If you prefer shorter,stick with either the 270-7 or 270-7H. I'm just old school that way. lol I prefer the E glass stuff. I like to take 2" off the tip of the 270's. I leave the heavies full length. While composites are nice,I am just old school that way. It will whip the fish without breaking your back. If you want something nicer for a bait/light iron combo,the 6470 or 6480 works very well. They are also a faster action rod. The 270's are a fast action,whereas the 6470 and 6480 are an extra fast action. The Calstar Grafighter blanks are good. Lately,I have become more of a Batson fan though. Great blanks at a great price. Very good quality stuff. I like their composites.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/20/2015 01:19AM by Chuck McIntyre.

Randy,

For future reference:
The older Senator 3/0 reels had bronze bushing bearings. That may have changed. If your reel does have bushing bearings, a heavy weight gear lube or heavy weight engine oil works well for the bushings.
The older JigMaster reels came with bushings. I believe they still come with the bushings.
The JigMaster Hi Speed (high gear ratio) 505 and 506(?) came with ball bearings.

Don Becker

Thanks Donald, I look into that when I get the reel. The guy in bought it from was great. After ordering, he called me up and told me if I wasn't fully satisfied, send it back for a full refund, including shipping. He completely rebuild, so hopefully will be a while before needing to relube.

I was looking at glass, but I kind of want to put an aluminum gimbal on that I can put a cover over. That way I can fight with a belt, if I ever get one. A lot of the glass butts so big and require such a large gimbal, I can't find a cover. Or the tip is so big that I can't go below a 12 size ring for the tip top.

As far as action I'm still up in the air. Doing a lot of research. But I'm leaning toward F or MF. My spinner I built for the boat is an MF and I liked it OK, but of course haven't hooked up with a yellowtail either.