I am trying to make sense of guide size placement for a spinning rod. I think I have a general understanding on it, but want to make sure. So far all my builds have been kits but now I am venturing into setting up my rods from scratch. My next build will be the MHX L904 blank. There is no set reel for the rod since I change reels a lot depending on where I will be fishing, so I figure the NGC and the 27x set up may not me the right choice for guide placement since they are more reel specific. So the next concept that I found was KR system. So if said rod was to be set up for a 4000 series reel my guide layout would be 25,12,7, with either a 7 or 6 choker guide depending on what my running guides will be used. And if I build the rod to use a 2000-3000 series reel it would be 20,10,6 with 6 being a choker and my runners. Placement of the butt guide would be around 20-21” form the reel as a good starting point. I know that from here I will need to do a static test and casting test to fine tune the rod. If I understand the system right then I can use any reel that falls in the class size that the rod was set up for and the rod will perform well.
Now on to reel sizes, it seems that there is no standard for spinning reels. If this is so what is the general rule for sizing a spinning reel. Is it the mono line size and how much the reel can hold example 3000 series would be in the line class of 10-12lbs mono, a 4000 12-15lbs mono and a 5000 15-20lbs mono. Or is it the size of the spool which I believe is still related to the line size the reel can hold at the highest capacity
Thank you in advance for your help.

Jason,
The beauty of custom rod building is that you can build the rod in what ever fashion you choose.

The 25,12,7 down to 7 is typically a good guide set for a spinning rod set up.

Put the reel on it that you are comfortable with, and will handle the line that you choose. Personally for that blank and likely line, I would typically use a 2500 sized reel.

Start with the butt guide at 20 inches from the reel seat with a 9-10 inch back grip and you should be in good shape.

Basically, tape on a guide where ever it is needed to insure that the blank is loaded correctly and that the line follows the contour of the loaded blank and do some test casting. Then, make any adjustments that you see fit.

On most of the spinning rods that I build with this size reel; I will use a high frame butt guide to insure no line slap on the rod blank. Then, conventional height guides for the reduction guides and fly guides for the runners.

Good luck

Jason, KR Concept is no more reel friendly than NGC or 27X. All have some latitude for "fudging" a little so don't base your build on one concept being more "reel friendly" than another. Also, don't base your build only on reel size. Line type and test are very important in selecting a reduction train. Heavy mono will always take a bigger stripper regardless of reel size and light braid will shoot through a small stripper coming from a larger reel. You are right, there is no standard for spinning reel sizes, but the SERIES numbers are a general guideline as to spool size, capacity and height...and yes there are exceptions. And, I don't think you will find a set-up that is optimized for a wide variety of reels.

I notice you mention the butt guide and then jump to static testing. I don't see any mention of the careful development of the reduction train, which is where most of the "performance" aspects of your layout reside. The kits you have built in the past have given you a blueprint for good performance but you are about to embark on a journey that will result in your understanding of WHY things are done the way they are...no more instruction sheets - only ideas, theories and concept to guide your way. It's great that you're ready for the "leap", but I can't help but get the feeling you've rushed through some of the fundamentals. There are plenty of knowledgeable people here to help you and lots of resources that can give you some insight concerning the "why" part of a great layout.

Jason,

The reel size is directly governed by the line test rating of the rod blank. If the blank is rated for say, 6 to 10 lb line you would not need to put a size 4000 reel on the rod. Let the blank line rating guide your reel selection.

Don Campbell
don@sensorfishingrods.com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/01/2015 10:30AM by Donald R Campbell.

Thank you for the advice. Your guide set up was what I was thinking high frame for the butt and normal and then fly guide. I guess I may still be confused on what a 2500 size reel would be or any of the other reel sizes.

Jason,
I tend to base reel sizes on the sizes of the typical Shimano reel:

[fish.shimano.com]

Notice that in each reel type, there are a variety of sizes ranging from small to large. The smaller and shorter reels have lower model numbers and the taller and or larger reels have larger number model numbers.

For example - sizes xxx2000, xxx2500, xxx3000, xxx4000

This is a general size that many other brands tend to also use.

Be safe

I have both 2500 & 3000 Shimano reels and the difference in spool size almost makes no difference in optimal guide placement or guide sizes for these reels. Guide placement for the 3000 will work very well for a 2500 reel and vice versa. I have tested in both directions and the resulting builds are most identical. The 27x, GPS and kr gps systems give you a good starting point. But there is always wiggle room in tweaking guide sizes and placement for what you consider optimal performance. Tape on the guides grab the reel of your choice do a stress test and go out and start casting to see how it performs with different reels and start tweaking with guide placement and even guide sizes (if you have different sizes on hand). This is very educational, and I think you will be pleasantly surprised that you can find a very good guide layout that will work very well for a couple of reel types without a lot of tweaking. This undertaking will give a lot of insight into how reel size, guide size, guide placement and blank action interact for optimal casting performance. Experience is the greatest teacher.

I guess I don't see how the rod line rating dictates reel size. For 6-10 I don't see a requirement for a reel as big as a 4000, but there is nothing wrong with a 4000.

Go to the on-line Anglers Resource/Fuji (links on left margin) catalog (next to last link in the series on the left of the catalog first page) and look at pages 46 and 47 for some really good info. Note that the guide sizes recommended will be influenced by the type of line and pound test. I have a spinning rod that has become a favorite of mine, 7 foot IP medium power/moderate action, use 10-15 braid on it, first guide is a KLH 16, running guides are size 3 micros. Casts very well, and is super sensitive for an RX 7 blank. Partly due to a good blank and partly due to the small guides, I expect. I use a 2500 Shimano on it, works just fine.

Michael,

I miss- typed my reply. I meant to type "you would not need to put a size 4000 reel on the rod". I just noticed my error this morning and corrected it. 'sorry about that !

Don Campbell
don@sensorfishingrods.com

well the blank is rated for 10-20lbs mono its going to be an inshore rod. That's why I was looking to set it up with the 4000. I was going to use the computer program to give me a base line on guide sizes. I was thinking about getting a couple of different sizes to play around with. My first thought was to go with the MW30 or the basic MW set but I really wanted to try and see what I could do with the KR guides.

My advice. Get a reel that comes with two spools. Pick the reel size based on how many yards you need it to hold. For trout not so many yards. For tarpon a lot more yards:) Only you know what you need. Chances are you can find a reel that holds around 200 yards of 10 mono on one spool and roughly the same amount of 20# braid on the other spool (just an example). A guide train that works well with 10# mono will do fine with 20# braid as it is limper. Now you cover both ends of the blanks rating with no need to change reels and/or worry about guide sizes. A decent copolymer 10# mono will often test stronger as will many 20# braids. A 30/25 Y framed moving down in 3 to 4 guides to a 6/4 sf fly rod style guide would be where I was heading.

I don't think you are out of line with a 4000 reel. I fish a 3000 on an 8-17# rated blank.

Russ in Hollywood, FL.