Since I started this rod building business I have built 30 rods this year(Just for a side deal not a living). I have been building for about 6 years but clearly do not know everything. I have had 2 tip breaks due to hang ups underwater which the customers understood it would not be warranted and they both have ordered more rods. I just got a call on a 3rd rod the customer stated he broke on a cast. It is a mhx sb812. The rod is 3 months old and should not break on cast. The break is about 2 feet from the real seat. Seems he may have damaged the rod or could it just break on a cast. I would like to make it right with him but do not want to give my work away. Any tips on how to approach the issue and how often do you guys have to deal with damaged rods.

Dealing with broken rods is one of the biggest problems in all of custom rod building. Unlike large commercial rod manufacturers that build thousands, or even hundreds of thousands of rods, you can't simply build in costs for "no questions asked" type replacements by adding a quarter to the price of each rod.

A break down that low in the rod could indeed be a defect, but could have also been brought on by a recent blow, overstress or crush fracture. Any of these might go unnoticed at the time and then on the next cast, or even a few casts later, result in a failure at that point. If he has been using the rod for a couple months and has caught some decent fish with it, then it's unlikely to have been due to a defect or it would have reared its head much sooner than now. About all you can do is take a look at the rod and inspect for other tell-tale damage in that area. Was it a clean break? Is there any evidence of long splintering? Can you find any gouges or marks around the area of the break? All these things indicate prior damage.

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It's not a clean break I don't have the rod in hand yet just a photo. The break looks like a L shape .

MHX blanks come with a great lifetime transferable warranty. You have to register the blank's serial number online with MHX for the warranty to go into effect. If registered go the the MHX web site fill out the warranty claim form. Send this plus 4" sections from either side of the break and $15 and they will send you a new blank no questions asked. I have done this a few times and the service has been fast and hassle free; I had no complaints. Being a great blank for the money plus their warranty are reasons that I do not hesitate to buy mhx blanks.

The problem for David, I would think, is that a new blank does not equate to a new rod, which he'll have to build for the customer either at his own expense, or to the customer.

If the break shows long splintering you're most likely looking at a crush failure, which may not completely broken until the next time the rod was cast. Forward me the photo and I'll be happy to take a look. If the resolution is good enough for me to see a few things, I can get you pretty darn close as to what caused it to break.

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A new blank is much better than nothing! Knowing how the blank broke gives you nothing but a still broken rod. Guides, reel seat, winding checks and sometimes the handle can be salvaged from the broken rod and reused. The customer may be more than willing to pay a reasonable labor charge to replace the rod. Have done this before and happy customers come back again and again. Do not hesitate to use your warranty, which is one of the reasons you bought the blank in the first place.

Actually, if he knows how and/or why the blank broke he will then know how to handle any warranty issues with the customer. If the customer was at fault, he might require the customer to pay for rebuilding the rod. If the customer was not at fault, it's doubtful he would charge the customer anything, nor would the customer likely to be willing to pay for the rebuild in that instance.

I'm sure he'll get a new blank, but he needs to know if the blank was defective or if the customer did something that caused the breakage.

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Will the owner of the rod say he stepped on the rod --- ????
Or got it caugh in a door Or anything that was his fault
Sounds like he is better off sending it in and or if Tom can see what may have happened be better
Is it not usually said it is usually user error

No one wants to pay because -- they -- broke there rod

Bill - willierods.com

I have sent back several broken rod pieces to mhx and I tell mhx what the happened to the rod according to the customer's account. In one instance mhx said that the break was not due to a blank failure. But they replaced it anyway without any further questions! It is hard to call a customer a liar; you have to take them at their word. I think mhx realizes this and wants to keep both your customer and you happy so you will buy more blanks from them. This works and is a good business strategy by mhx. I do not care how the customer breaks a rod I let the blank manufacturer figure that out. If they do not honor the warranty request so be it, the customer can get mad at the manufacturer rather than you. I should mention that I have sent back broken rods from other manufacturers and have yet to have a warranty claim denied. However, some with more hassles than others. I try to buy blanks that come with some kind of a warranty. This does help to sell rods. I do have a number of honest people that admit they broke the rod by accident or stupidity and will have me make them a new one using savage parts from the broken rod to save them a little money. This makes them happy and keeps them coming back. Hope this helps.

All first line blanks come with a warranty against defects in materials and workmanship. I'm not aware of any that don't.

If you replace any and all rods no questions asked, you won't be in the business very long. Do you really want customers who routinely break rods due to abuse to keep coming back?

And... if you know how to identify breakage by looking at the left behind tell-tale signs (RodMaker Volume 12 #5) you will be surprised at how many customers "come clean" on what actually happened. Of course, sometimes a customer damages a rod and doesn't know it at the time, but again, if you have the knowledge and ability to identify the reason the rod broke, you can spare yourself a lot of headaches.

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Food for thought
Why is it that no blank or rod builders have a Full Unconditional Warrantee
Because they want to see the break of there rod or blank and now adays because of Tom K and his ability to show how and why a blank or rod broke there is now a Unconditional warrantee and if you break or a rod breaks they will replace it -- BUT they have to see the pieces to determin how and why it broke
Because they give a lot of money away

Bill - willierods.com

I am not talking about replacing the rod for free! People I build rods for know up front that only the blank has a warranty and my labor costs are not included. As I mentioned the manufacturer does a good job identifying what happened and this saves me a lot of heartaches. I do not have to argue with a person over how the rod broke. In 45 years of building rods I have only had one person that was a chronic rod abuser and he knew that I knew it, so did not quibble over the cost to build a new one. I am a hobby builder and all of my customers come by word of mouth and all are avid fishermen who, for the most part, take care of their equipment. Over the past 10 years (been retired for 7 years) I build or repair from 80 to 150 rods a year and have not had a person who was unwilling to agree to my price for building repairing or replacing a rod. Many of my customers are repeat customers who bring new customers with them. The reason for this is I treat them with respect and try to build them the rod they want for a fair price. I have a lot of respect and admiration for you professional rod builders; it is a hard way to make a living. I am new to this forum, as far as posting, but have visited this forum for many years and have received a wealth of info from all of you, and this info has made me a better rod builder. Building rods is an addictive hobby, but i love it. Experience has told me that a satisfied customer is a repeat customer. This is the take home message for all of my rambling.

David,
I treat a situation like this:
1. I will offer to repair the rod for free.
2. I will also offer to build him a new rod for a 30% discount off of the price of the first rod. Most folks for which this has happened, ask both for the repair, as well as the new rod.

Be safe

Like Norman Miller, I have been retired for 7 years, been building rods for 30 years+, in the rod building business 11 years and 'am what I guess is considered a "hobby builder". I don't make much on a rod and I am in a quandary right now. I built a Rainshadow Immortal IMMC76XH rod for a guy in my bass club this past April. I just got an email from him say he broke the rod on a 2 lb. fish! I was really surprised and this blank is an extra heavy. I have not gotten the rod back from him yet; but when I do, I will contact Batson and ship the broken section to them for their review. They have always been more than fair with me regarding breakage evaluation.

My quandry is regarding my expenses with the rod rebuild. being retired and living on a very limited income, it is difficult to absorb the additional costs for the rod replacement. Having been in the professional consulting business for 40 years, I know the "word of mouth" can be a very powerful marketing benefit or detriment. The guy that I built the rod for in April recently got laid off of work. I guess I bite the bullet and absorb the additional time and costs to rebuild the rod.

What is the general opinion in this regard with the other builders out there?

Don Campbell
don@sensorfishingrods.com

Sorry I haven't responded been fishing . Tom is right I will send off for a new blank. My warranty is after the first 30 days the customer is responsible for all labor and additional parts for the new blank period which everyone knows prior to the build and again when they pick up the rod. I am a very nice guy and hate to see someone upset because of a breakage but I can't afford to give rods away because of misuse. I think I will just have to stand by my warranty and maybe offer him a discount on a future build. I guess it would not be an issue if it was used for more than 3 months.

Donald,

You're in good company - most all rod builders run into this sooner or later, and sometimes more often than they'd like.

Generally, blank manufacturers are very good about sending blank replacements, even when the blank may not have been defective. They nearly always give the customer the benefit of the doubt. As you know, however, it's hard for the small production custom rod builder to do this. Even a single replacement, at no cost to the customer, may result in a complete wipe of the profit made from the original rod, if not a couple of them.

Different builders approach warranties differently. Some do not warranty parts in any form or fashion. In other words, if the manufacturer supplies a new blank, they'll give that to the customer and offer to rebuild the rod for the price of labor. But then it's the customer that's paying the fee for a breakage that may indeed have been caused by a defective blank. Most don't like that - why should they incur any expense for a breakage that wasn't their fault? You see the problem there obviously.

Your particular rod breakage needs to be carefully scrutinized for signs of abuse, high sticking, etc. The thing is, many fishermen simply don't understand that much of what they do with a rod can easily lead to breakage. The cable fishing shows have caused more broken rods than any single entity in fishing history.

We have an upcoming article in a near future issue of RodMaker that deals with various warranties offered by custom rod builders, along with the pros and cons of each. It's a tricky thing to deal with and no policy will successfully meet all concerns satisfactorily.

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To save on shipping cost for broken returns, most blank manufacturers only need the broken piece of the rod with 6 inches of blank on each side of the break.

They can check the reason for the break with this amount of blank. Double check with the manufacturer before sending an entire rod back for warranty.

The other thing that is often sufficient is to send several photos of the broken rod. If that is the case, then no money is required to send the e-mail with the pictures to the vendor.

Be safe

I would like to Thank all of You for sharing your opinions on this broken rod issue. Also Tom your comment reminded me that I needed to renew my subscription to RodMaker Magazine.... 'just completed the renewal process.

Due to my clients unemployment situation and the fact that he and his wife just had a baby, I believe this rebuild will be on my "nickel"!

Don Campbell
don@sensorfishingrods.com