Hi,

I have tried many brands of thread, over 20 plus years of rod building. Metallic thread is my preference for many reasons. I am tired of metallic thread that fades in no time, mylar coming off the base thread in the middle of a wrap, metallic thread that feels like sand paper even before it comes off the spool, blue metallic that is showing silver spots while on the spool, oh and lest we forget knots in the spool. Of course many of you can add your problems to my list.

I know some of you will say you have never experienced these problems. To that I will say you are very fortunate.

It blows my mind that a thread manufacturer can not make thread that serves us properly. Shame on them! But maybe our suppliers are not concerned about our thread problems and will keep selling problematic thread as long as we purchase it. How many times I have made a spool of problematic thread work. I am sure many of you have also. Send the spool back and they will probably send you another spool and possibly with the same problems.

Many of us buy thread by the box or in larger quantities. It can be a year or more before the problem is in front of us. Will the supplier take back the full box with a full refund? With a bit of arm bending they might.

So back to my question. Are you willing to pay more for a premium thread product without all the problems we experience now? I am! Now to find a company that will step up to the plate and hit a home run with their product.

Has anyone glued a guide to a piece of blank and then coated the area with finish? I have to give that a try and see how well the guide stays in place. Maybe we can solve the thread problem that way and save money by not using thread!

Well I guess it is time for me to contact my supplier and order some of the Fuji metallic thread and see how well that works.

Now back to making a spool of blue metallic work.

Capt Neil Faulkner

Hi Capt Neil

Well No The prices of parts are shooting to the roof
I just had a guy wanting a bass rod built for 100.00 or less I wonder when they go for a lob - do they work for 5.00 and hour ??

Bill - willierods.com

Capt Neil,

Have you tried the Makoi yet? It has been the maker of choice I have turned to after becoming frustrated with the others.

Tom

I try to get all my parts from one supplier just to keep the shipping charges down They don't seem to have any one else selling there thread I have herd good things about it though

Bill - willierods.com

Bingham Enterprises sells Makoi thread. I stock nylon and metallics in both sizes A & D and some perm color. It is not yet listed on my website but if you are interested go to this site www.makoithread.com select the colors you want and just e-mail me.

Wholesale pricing available to those who qualify.


Thank you

captain Neil I feel your pain I wrapped a rod today with metallic thread and had the same problems even a knot. I would pay more for good thread it would make the job go so much easier .

Absolutely I would pay more for a good thread i've tried bunch and the best one has been prowrap and surprising pacbay metallic hasn't been too bad either. And just a heads up unless all your doing is hand wrapping a fly rod don't buy the fuji metallic. Theres not much strength to it and will break or unwind if there is too much tension (it doesn't take much). Don't want to knock on the fuji threads because the NCP's are awesome, but my experience with them wasn't the best.

Capt. Neil, my experience with fuji is much different than the post above me. I use a power wrapper and haven't had the problems Justin is experiencing. I've used the fuji copper metallic thread on a few rods. Works great and no fading issues but a bit pricey. I also like the fish hawk silver metallic thread. It's strong and doesn't get those little knots and rough texture. Like other builders I would pay more for thread if a company can work out the problems we all experience. I've thought about using the black shrink tubing for electrical connectors as wraps and applying epoxy over it...lol. It might work. MH

I now use pro-wrap It has it faults but I have learned to work around them Only use metallic for trim

Bill - willierods.com

What, besides appearance, are the advantages of metallic thread?

Nothing

N



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/02/2015 01:07PM by Phil Ewanicki.

Not one of the most valued rods I am aware of: Garrison,Granger, Leonard, Orvis, Payne - has one wrap of metallic thread.

Hi Builders,

Thank you for your responses. I wrote up a post earlier today but I think I screwed up when I posted it.

Phil, I went right to the metallic thread as soon as Merrick Tackle started selling it. I liked that I could top wrap with lighter colors than the under wrap, except for pearl. Yes, sometimes it is a pain in the neck but I liked the results.

It is a shame that all our efforts can be screwed up by a companies component or supply item. Guess I have to try Fuji blue metllic in d size and see what happens. I do not mind spending more if I get the results needed and possibly save time.

Capt Neil Faulkner

Neil,
Yes, I read your post and find that you like to wrap rods with different kinds of Metallic thread in an under or over wrap and also for trim wraps.

But, for the head boat fisherman, does the use of metallic thread on the rod have any effect on the fishing, or the fisherman.

I realize that there are folks out there that want good functional tools to ply their trade. Then, there are others who enjoy having a pretty rod to hang on a wall. Then, there is the 3rd group who like to have a "pretty, shiny rod" to ply their trade.

But, as has been said before, it is great to be able to provide a rod that pleases the client to do the things that the client wants to do with the rod.

Be safe

Great Post Capt. Neil!! I took the post for what it was intended; a cry to the industry to provide a better product. I don’t think it was intended to be a Metallic vs. Nylon debate. I think both have their uses. As always the dedicated guys (on the Bass side) just want sensitivity and a desired action/power. They could care less what color you use. Most of the other guys want something unique.

Yes, I would pay more for better product. I use a power wrapper and I absolutely can’t stand it when the metallic thread springs off the spool once you finish a wrap and cut it or relieve the tension. The absolute Worst is when you are putting on the end wraps of a weave or crosswrap, you cut the design threads, and then continue to find a knot where the company has a splice in the spool.

I have been slow to try Fuji or Makoi. Not sure why. I guess I was waiting to learn from others that have made the jump. $3 vs. $6 is not a big deal to me for a superior product. I’ve learned a lot from this post.

Gabe Neal

Neal's Custom Rods

Suspect it is another "saltwater vs freshwater" thing. Saltwater rods leave more room for stuff.....underwraps....trim bands....etc. Used to be I always used an underwrap...and 3 to 4 colors on a guide wrap....and I'm strongly opposed to "bling". Nowadays I'm using more single foot guides with no underwarp.....one nylon color with one metallic trim band color....but that is on 20-30# class stuff and under.

In short I would gladly pay several times more for a good metallic. If it handled as well as the best nylons from the past....if its color never faded in the sun.....if it didn't misbehave when I pulled it thru at the end up a wrap......if it didn't act like a spring steel wanting to ruin things the second I cut it loose from the spool. On well I'm dreaming....but heck yes I'd pay 5 times what I used to pay for good nylon.

Russ in Hollywood, FL.

Fuji's limited color selection has kept some folks from trying the thread and I just wanted to interject that we introduced 10 new colors at ICAST. We will be posting details in the coming weeks. Metallic colors have been added as well.

As the price of parts goes up so does the price of YOUR completed rod
IMHO you should learn to overcome the faults learn how to work around them
Don't know about you but all of these higher prices are screwing me

Bill - willierods.com

Hi Bill,

Yes, the cost of building a rod has increased year after year and many of us have eaten part or all of the increase to keep our prices reasonable, in buyers terms LOW. That is fine as the buyer gets the benefit.

Have you looked at the increase in prices that factory rods have gone thru in recent years. In many cases they cost almost as much as my customs. The factories have no problem raising their prices. So why should we eat the increases? I refuse to eat the increases any more!

A generation ago as a custom builder trying to get started, I will admit to a fear of being rejected by possible customers if my prices were to high. So in order to get started and establish a name for myself I almost gave rods away. I am sure many of you have done the same. Back 30 years ago it was almost impossible to sell a rod for $65 especially since I was selling to party boat anglers.

Fast forward to the present. I believe I ask a fair cost for my labor. Fair both to the customer and me. Would I like to charge more? Yes. Would my customers pay more? Maybe some but not all. Customers know what my labor rate and how I price my rods before they come for a design meeting. This eliminates some potential customers but not many. Usually they have no idea what a custom rod might cost.

My goal is to do what is fair to my customers and fair to me.

What does an angler look at first when he sees a new rod? I suspect it is the thread work, both basic and fancy. That is why I will pay more for excellent thread that does not give me the headaches that todays thread presents. Better visual representation and less headaches. Many of you builders have experienced an angler saying, "what beautiful thread work and finish application."

Bill, after all these years, trust me, I learned a few things that helps me get around thread problems. But, I should not have to work around problems that with quality control at the factory level could be eliminated.

The color blue seems to be a big problem but all the other colors have caused grief.

So my game plan is this. I will order some Fuji blue metallic thread with my next order, pay the extra price and see how I like it. Being a positive person I hope that it is an excellent product for the increased cost.

Capt Neil Faulkner