One thing I've never understood is the underlying tone used here sometimes that guys who dont do 12hr crosswraps and grips are somehow not worthy of the "custom rod builder" status. That a guy who is building low value rods isnt even a custom rod builder nor may even have the skill to out build a malaysian kid in some far off province.

How does that tone work with the sponsors on the left who are trying to court ANYONE who wants to buy their products?

Heck, If I had a vested interest in seeing the industry grow, I dont know, like, lets say a component shop or a rodbuilding website, I would open up my arms to anyone who was interested and encourage them to keep at it.

Maybe the plying rod builder should build rc cars and leave the rod building to the true professionals......

I'm just not sure how some comments are made knowing a great deal of the business those sponsors on the left count on are from new, hobby builders.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/17/2014 05:00PM by Adam Curtis.

Adam,
X10000 on your comment.

A rod build is a rod build. A blank sale is a blank sale as is a component sale.

As the saying goes Buy, Buy, Buy

But always be safe

Adam, some of the "most" custom rods that I have ever built may have not looked very custom to the average person. I sent an article on this to Tom but he hasn't published it yet. Maybe sometime in the future. Lots of things make custom rods, not just fancy butt wraps.

Who spends 12 hours on grips and wraps?

I really don't see where where you see that tone here. I have seen plenty of rods built by some of the best in the business. Most of the bass rods are plain Jane withe the focus on performance. Same with off shore stuff. Sure there are some artists out there but most of the ones selling rods in high quantities don't do the art.

Freddwhy (Rapt-Ryte)

probably because people don't want to pay for it For any weave or butt wrap if you spend some time What are ya going to charge $5.00 an houre And if you go for a job and the boss says he pays 5.00 an houre You going to take the job

Bill - willierods.com

from my view it's all about performance.
perfect example. right now I have a customer who came in a said he wanted a rod built for a specific local area river. he was pretty set on length, line wt. etc. Then he asked how it would compare to the one his Brother swears by that came from BPS. we sat down and designed the rod together. I told him up front that it would not have "bling" but would be a great rod. After it was done he took it out with his brother and they compared. the Brother gave in and said the custom rod was better. he commented that he had never seen guides like that(microwaves) at BPS and the grip was better and it actually cast better.
now I'm on rod two for the guy and one for his Brother.
Don't get me wrong, I think that the rod with weaves and such are gorgeous and can still perform and i appreciate the guys and gays who do them. If you can add that to your rod and if you are selling them get a few more bucks then all the better.
BTW I've never got the impression that those who don't do cross weaves etc are inferior. Thre are those who do and whose who don't and I feel that we all pretty much get along. Correct me if I'm wrong.

X10 on Gary's comment.

Most of my clients could care less about any sort of fancy weave or artwork.

Rather, they want the very best performing rod that they can have for a given price.

In fact, many of the clients want nothing more than a black wrap on the guides with 0 trim of any kind. They consider these rods to be very high performance tools, to do a better job for them in catching fish.

Be safe

X10 on Gary's comment.

Most of my clients could care less about any sort of fancy weave or artwork.

Rather, they want the very best performing rod that they can have for a given price.

In fact, many of the clients want nothing more than a black wrap on the guides with 0 trim of any kind. They consider these rods to be very high performance tools, to do a better job for them in catching fish.

Be safe

There was a thread a while back on what qualifies a guy as a custom builder and requirements for a rod to be considered custom. I learned that many of the rods I've built are not custom.

In this thread it was implied guys going after low value rods "consider" themselves custom rod builders and that some of them build worse than the factory kid overseas.

I dont really care. I just wonder about rod component companies who would love to grow their sales telling a novice customer he isnt a custom rod builder for any reason. Maybe they only want experienced pro's. I dunno.

Celebrate em all I say.

I love when someone plays Twister with words - left hand blue. Absolutely a lot of builders sellign rods do not do as good of a job as factory rods being built today. Where was it stated that these rods were being built overseas? St Croix and Seeker both do a great job with the rods they build. What makes builders who might build 50 rods a year think they are doing a better job than someone who builds 50 rods a week? Pictures don't lie, but words do. I'd love for everyone posting and giving advice to post pics of their rods so we can see just how much better they are than factory rods.

I don't build FW rods, but with teh amount of choices from low to high end that are out there my guessing opinion is that most builders doing well are selling their knowledge more than their work. IT's like a woman who hires a personal shopper to get teh right colors and clothing to make them look better. A FW fisherman could go to a store and spend hours there guessing at which rod will work for what he is doing, or he can save all that time and go to a builder, tell them what they want out of the rod, and let the builder find the right blanks, components, and put it together.

All teh artwork is worth jack if the rod isn't the right one for the fishing that the person will be doing. THis is why I only build rods for teh type of fishing that I do, I consider myself an "expert" in that area and that is why people come to me. The fact tha tI can do what I do artistically is secondary. Right Foot Red.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/17/2014 06:23PM by Billy Vivona.

Adam,

Quality and performance isn't about thread art, or feather inlays, or any other aesthetic enhancement. It is about performance and craftsmanship. Even a plain jane rod can be judged as to how well the fit and finish is. It's not so much about what you do, but that whatever you do is done to a high level.

Billy makes a good point as well - a good portion of a successful custom rod builder's job is to take the information the customer provides him with and deliver the product that does exactly what the customer needs.

Not so many years ago I heard a custom rod builder stand up in a room of other custom rod builders and make this statement, "I've seen a lot of custom rods, and most of them aren't very good." There is a lot of truth in his statement. Guys who wonder why they can't command top dollar for their rods may wish to take a harder look at their work.

..................

Well that was an interesting thread. Now back to your regular programing.

I agree completely with Billy. Form must follow function. However, how do you sell function if your rods are essentially a cookie cut out of every other rod out there?

This time I will play devil's advocate.... Two rods sitting next to each other.

Rod A: Name brand: nice cork split grip, micro guides, nice looking reel seat, fit and finish as good as any other factory rod.
Rod B: Custom: nice cork split grip, micro guides, different but still nice reel seat, fit and finish better than factory rod,.

Both of these rods are the same price or maybe within 50$ of each other. Which one do you think the customer is going to buy? And why? What is there to differentiate and therefore justify the cost difference in the custom rod? This is the question that anyone selling their rods must ask themselves.

"Be a custom rod builder"

"Build your own rods"


But then be ready to be labeled and told how bad you are!


Makes sense! Carry on!

Go to a tackle shop and see how many of the spinning rods have NGC guide layout. Customers will have to spend a couple hundred to just get a rod with a straight cone of flight. Any micro guide spinning rods? I think there is still alot a builder has to offer besides good looks. Fly rod guys don't want a bunch of flashy stuff, but there is still a lot of style and performance they can get from a small rod builder when plain Jane high end factory rods are over $700. I went with a guide, when he handed me the Sage rod I was going to be fishing with that day I thought @#$%&, look at this pitted crappy cork grip on this rod.

Greg
Aptos, CA

Adam Curtis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Be a custom rod builder"
>
> "Build your own rods"
>
>
> But then be ready to be labeled and told how bad
> you are!
>
>
> Makes sense! Carry on!


Once you hang out a shingle, you are indeed subject to the opinion of the consumer.

...............

Adam, there's a simple fix - dont' build poor quality rods for sale. I'm not about to come close to apologizing for speaking the truth. But feel free to imagine that beacuse you can wrap a guide and glue a reel seat that you can consider yourself a top notch builder.

PS> I'm not saying "you" Adam, just in general.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/17/2014 10:06PM by Billy Vivona.

Like Billy says Are you willing to put your Name On The Rod You Have Built
Do you you back up your work

Bill - willierods.com

Pretty interesting topic! Nice work Phil.