I decided to go with 10wt rod that has a great reputation from the guys on the Stripers Online forum. It came while I was gone and I got to check it today. The Action Angle is exactly 65 degrees so it is a fast action as advertised. But it took 135 pennies to deflect it 36" of it 108" length which comes up to an ERN of 13.41. I was hoping for somewhere between 10wt to 11wt, but a 13.4wt is a bit more rod than I want to strip streamers with. It's actually a saltwater rod but I would have thought a 10wt saltwater would be similar to a 10wt freshwater rod. Then again, the saltwater guys may be using 10wt line but throwing a saltwater fly the size of a small cat!

I'm going to exchange it for a 9wt and see where that one measures. I've got my handy dandy CCS rod holder mounted in the garage and in a couple of minutes, I can mount the rod and know exactly what

65 degrees does not mean it is a "fast" action, only that it is faster than those with lower AAs and slower than those with higher AA's (is an 8-foot rod a long rod?). Nor does an ERN of 13.41 indicate that it is not a 10-weight rod - ERN is power, not line weight. In fact, that would make an outstanding rod for throwing long distances of 10-weight line.

.............

I fished a 10 wt Temple Fork TiCr something a few years ago that had an ERN in the low 14s, it was outstanding as a 10 wt as Tom noted. First time and last time I fished a Teeny TS-750 flyline, thought my TT 400 line was bad on the arm.

Tim,
Some measure whether they like a fly blank by its ability to throw heavy hads. Even the RIO Outbound integrated heads in a #10 is 425gr. A "normal" #10 line is 280gr. So, yeah, they look for a brute of a rod.

I keep mentioning CTS banks because I find that some of their blanks are right-on-the-money re ability to cast "normal" #10 lines. Try the Affinity-MX in #10. I have a UK friend that cannot load his Sage Xi2 at all. I shipped him the CTS Affinity-MX in a #10 and he will never use another #10 again.

Herb

Well I think I'm as confused as I was 10 years ago. I was under the impression that the ERN would establish which weight fly line would be suitable for casting for that peticular rod - I'm not sure what I've learned from the system anymore. Seems like the more I think I know the less I actually know.

ERN is rod power, not line weight. We've covered this many, many times.

If you wish to match a line weight per the rod's power, you need to use an equation and possibly a factor as well. You can begin with ERN=ELN but this will vary and require a factor depending on how much line you intend to put beyond the tip. For heavier line weight rods and longer casting distances, you might try ERN-1 (or-2) = ELN.


.................

Tim,
Measure the ERN of your nine weight as something to relate to. How does that measure up to this new blank? What line do you want to use, like a Teeny 400? Can you borrow a friend's rod with the type of line you want, cast it, and measure the ERN of that rod? ERN gives you a number so that you can compare these rods to each other.

Like said Before you get rid of it Try several lines Depending on the line and it's weight I would dare say it may work better or load better with an 11 or 12 Also depending on how fare you want to cast

Bill - willierods.com

Like many have said. It depends on the line out of the guides. A fly line is rated by how much the first 30 ft weight. If you are doing short casts (brook trout) you may want to jump up a few line sizes to load the rod. if you are casting say 90 ft (surf casting without a shooting head) you will want to jump down a few maybe. It also depends on HOW you cast. Do you cast agresive, dubble halling all the time do you do a motified spey and water load the rod the way I do? Many many factors. If the rod feels nice and has great action give it a try, worst case you build it and sell it and try again. you can never have too many rods in the quiver right? I have a 5wt that I use a 320gn shooting head on that is somewhere around a 9+ wt but it works great with little effort I can cast a mile. It all depends on person, rod, flies, wind, moon cylce and whatever else you can factor in. Fishing has many many shades of grey.

I'm with Eric.

I'm also confused, is it a rod or a blank? If it's a rod, what is it?

Have you cast this rod yet? Do not rely solely on ERN/ELN/ESP whatever. It's a very imperfect science. There is no numeric formula that can substitute for casting it yourself and seeing how you like it. My take on the CCS thing is that is gives you a guideline and a starting basis for comparison, but that's all.

I have an 8wt that has an ERN of just over 10. For me, it's perfect with an 8 wt line. I can make long casts into the wind and it's been great. Others may cast the same rod and say it works them too hard.

Good luck, nothing worse than getting a new toy and finding out it isn't what you wanted.

Drew

It's a Colton Tradewinds 10wt - very popular with the guys on Stripers Online due to the stout butt sections these rods have. I was going to build one from a blank but the reviews were so good on this rod, plus they're on sale for 40% off, I thought I'd try one.

I had a reel with some 9wt line and went out yesterday and I was surprised how well I was able to cast it. Next time I'm at Cabelas I'm going to pick up some 10wt sink tip and see how the rod likes it. I'm used to casting a GLoomis 3wt and a Sage 5wt and I was expecting this 10wt to be somewhat of a bear but I was surprised how well it did cast. Of course it might be a different story after a day of stripping streamers and leech patterns - we'll see. I've been away from the forum for awhile so I'll have to brush up on what I thought I knew about ERN.

Mr. Collins,
While ERN is a measure of a blanks power, it can be effectively used to determine what line weight may work best for your casting style. For example: you may cast a rod at standard distances (for you) and find that it doesn't load all the way when using a line weight that matches the rod's ERN. In this case you would then increase your line weight until the rod performed to your satisfaction. After doing this repeatedly using multiple rods you can come up with your own personal formula that will tell you how ERN correlates to your casting style. An example of this would be ELN=ERN+2, meaning that for any given rod used at your standard distances you should use 2 line weights heavier than the rod's ERN. One could also factor in the AA (action angle) as well, which may look like: For AA 55-65 ELN=ERN+1 and for AA 65-80 ELN=ERN+2.

Please do not subscribe to the idea that the CCS is overly complex or unscientific. While there may be some additional variables (likely minor) not addressed by the CCS, it is an objective way to measure a blank's/rod's core properties, plain and simple. Subjective terms used to describe blanks or rods are always open to interpretation, and while seeming simple, will ultimately lead to more confusion.

-The Batson TEAM
BatsonEnterprises.com

Thanks Geoff, I dug out some data and found that my 7' GLX 3wt has an ERN of 3.27 and I have DT 4wt line on it's reel. My Sage SP 5wt has an ERN of 5.05 and I have 6wt line on that reel. Looks like my hillbilly verticle casting stroke needs a +1 line. On my 9wt I have 9wt line and I sort of roll my wrist in a Lefty Kreigh fashion so I can make a longer casting arc.

Maybe my casting style needs a 10wt for my 9wt rod and possibly an 11wt for my new 10wt !

Not for nothing but i read them ERN numbers as a 4wt will Generally have a high 3's and or low 4's
So your rods with those numbers should cast the 3 and 5 wt lines pretty darn well But it is all about how the caster likes to cast - speed of cast - distance of cast or The feel of the rod in hand with line being cast
But I am also talking a tip flex fast blank

Bill - willierods.com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/25/2011 04:09PM by bill boettcher.

bill boettcher Wrote:
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> Not for nothing but i read them ERN numbers as a
> 4wt will Generally have a high 3's and or low 4's



Willie - I have no clue what you just said here.

For a 4wt line the numbers IMHO the ERN should be around above 3.50 and below 4.50 Which puts ya in the ball park A stiffer rod may load better with a 5 wt line softer rod may load better with a 3
That 10 with numbers in the 13's would probably load better with a 12 line
Seams like the blank or rod is marked wrong as a 10

Bill - willierods.com

Bill,

You're completely leaving out the distance or line length involved. A rod intended to throw a very long length of 10-weight line would require an ERN of 11+.

...............

Tom

There is a lot I left out Like how much line the designer was thinking 30 - 60 feet from tip ???
Fast blank or moderate would make a difference With numbers like that I would have probably tried a 12 then maybe go up down it will probably shoot a 10 --- long
If he can get several lines and just try them he may be surprised

Bill - willierods.com